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Author: Laserman

Tokay, can we get this fixed please? [Copy link]

Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-17 07:10:53 |Show all posts
Right now are not worsened. They are slightly improved.
However, what will happen when few more UR will be added?
Until now new UR were added to both slot while the number of SR was fixed. That means that with every addition the chance of getting a specific UR became less but also the chance of getting a SR were becoming slimmer. Within the next 3 ur added the chance of getting a SR would have been less than 50%
Now, with a dedicated slot, this isn't going to happen.
On the other hand, the chance of finding a specific UR will loweer at double rate since new UR will not be added to one of 2 slot, splitting the lowering of chance, but to only one!!!

So let's say 10 new ur from now, with the old method we would have hade 7sr and 11 UR in each slot
With this new metod we will have 7sr in one slot and 22ur in the other....
Can u see now why we are heading to a loss with the new method?

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Rank: 8Rank: 8

Post time 2015-3-17 07:26:04 |Show all posts
Spike13 replied at 2015-3-17 07:10
Right now are not worsened. They are slightly improved.
However, what will happen when few more UR w ...

The UR's that can be added are not that many now.
And, yes, I said that as more UR's are added, it will dilute your chances.

But even with the existing method, your chances are also diluted as more UR's are added.
I agree, that in the long run, this makes the odds of a given UR appearing slightly less.
But, the fact still remains, that this mew method gives them an Equal chance to appear and the old method did not. At this time I don't think there are even 10 cards left in the Wiki for UR's to be added to shops, and they put them mostly in the IM shop and VIP. The IM shop has 28 UR's and Rimmon, but it's out of balance because the 1st 7 cards they placed in that shop show up in both slots. This needs to be corrected. That's what the OP and this thread is about.

If you want to "suggest" that they make a change to greatly increase the chance of getting UR's in the Arena shop, please go start your own thread.

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Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-17 15:37:40 |Show all posts
Edited by Spike13 at 2015-3-17 15:38

What the hell are you saying? Every week they add 1 or 2 new UR in the game, so there will be ALWAYS cards to add to the shops!!!

And for telling you that is ridiculus to be happy for fixing a minor problem (1% disparity in chamces between UR) at the cost of increasing a way bigger problem (drop rate of the same chances) i don't need another thread.
At the opposite, since this thread created the worsened state of things is just the right place!

Only way to fix this would be open another slot for the future added card... But then you would probBly come busting balls that the newer card have higher chances... (And who cares! 1% is jot the problem! Having only a 8% that is lowering is the problem!)
Btw those 7 usless sr have still the 14% chance each so the situation isn't even "equal"

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Rank: 8Rank: 8

Post time 2015-3-17 20:19:58 |Show all posts
Spike13 replied at 2015-3-17 15:37
What the hell are you saying? Every week they add 1 or 2 new UR in the game, so there will be ALWAYS ...

dude, there are 12 UR's in the Arena shop.
28 in the IM shop and 10 or so in the VIP shop.

It took over a year's worth of cards to get 12 into the Arena shop. Of those 12, most of them are the "early" UR cards. It was a miracle Befafes made it into the Arena shop. Most of the cards in the Arena shop are considered low value. There are a couple of Gems.

So, it will be more then a year to add 10 more to it.

The big problem is the IM shop. There's 28 UR's in there and 7 of them show up in 2 slots, clogging up the shop and dropping the odds for the other 22 UR's that only show up in one slot. A lot of those are good cards. That's the problem that needs to be fixed.

The Arena shop has a decent solution, we need one for the IM shop.
The only fix I see it for it, is to make all cards in that shop be able to appear in both slots.

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Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-17 23:48:42 |Show all posts
The only fix I see it for it, is to make all cards in that shop be able to appear in both slots"

That would be good, and would have been the right solution for arena too

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Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-18 00:50:17 |Show all posts
Hmm. I need to agree with Spike here. The new system in the arena shop is a minor improvement now, but hurts us in the long term. So your major point was the difference in chance for certain UR to appear. Yes, I agree. That problem is due to the fact that in slot4 more cards (total 14, 7 SR+7UR) are while in slot8 there are "only" 12 (7SR+5UR).

Thats means the chance to have a certain UR to appear in a single refresh is 1/14th for S4-URs and 1/12th if its in S8.

With the new method, S4 only has the 7 SRs. Making that slot basically worthless. The 12 UR currently availible via arenashop (not counting monthly featured of course) in S8 have a chance of 1/12th each to appear.
Ergo: Its no improvement if you were hunting a S8-UR and a slight improvement if you seek (former) S4-URs. But as new UR will be added into arena, the odds to finding the one UR that you hunt will get worse with the new system compared to the old one.

Example:
Assume they would have instead "fixed" the inequality by moving one S4-UR into S8. Making both slots a 13-card pool.

Old system: All URs would have a chance of 1/13 to appear on every refresh.
New system: All UR are in slot8, thus we have a 1/12 chance for a specific UR to appear. The new system wins - by a bit. ;)

But now lets add 4 UR into arenashop - and distribute them equally! Now every slot has a 15 card pool.
==>
Old system: Every UR has a 1/15 chance to appear on every refresh.
New system: In S8 there are now 16 UR. => Every UR has a 1/16 chance to appear.
The old system wins, and the margin gets larger the more UR you add into the arenashop.

I agree with spikes solution too: Make one big pool with all SR and UR (= currently 19 cards total) and make that pool appear in both cardslots.

The chance to have at least one of the UR you're hunting is then 1-(18/19)^2 = 10.2%
With a slim chance to have it actually appear in both cardslots in a single refresh: P = 1/19^2 = 0.28%.
And of course every card would have the same chances to appear in the shop. No inequalities here anymore. ;)

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Rank: 8Rank: 8

Post time 2015-3-18 03:01:20 |Show all posts
Feanyar replied at 2015-3-18 00:50
Hmm. I need to agree with Spike here. The new system in the arena shop is a minor improvement now, b ...

Both methods dilute the pool.
New method will dilute the pool a little more.

The point is, new method makes all UR in Arena shop have same chance to appear.
This was the Goal. And maybe for you and most high level players, R4 fire card is useless, but not useless to all.

They never promised UR's in this shop would have same chance to appear as SR. They only promised that UR's would all have equal chance.

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Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-18 03:12:26 |Show all posts
Personally I think that super rare fire cards are worthless to every one including the newbs. The srs are the same price as the URs but are much worse. It's a trap! I would love it if they just removed them altogether. Same thing for Rimmon in mare shop. I feel like they are just leaving them in to decrease the chance of you finding what you want without spending gold.

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Rank: 6Rank: 6

Post time 2015-3-18 03:17:25 |Show all posts
True, but achieving this equality could've been done by simply moving one UR from S4 into S8 to even things out without introducing an additional dilution. We'll get more than enough dilution in the long run anyways, up to the point where it becomes an endless task to just see 8 copies of a specific card. No need to speed up the process. ;)

Besides, I wouldnt call myself a highlvl player. Rather somewhere in the mid-tier. But if a newbie asks for advice in eg. kongchat, I always tell them not to buy SR in arenashop. Its a waste of honor if you could just get a good UR for it instead. Buying SR from shop doesnt help newbies at all. Its the contrary, it slows em down!
But maybe, since they split UR and SR into different slots they consider to change the price on SR now. That might change things in few cases - but in general it's still not a good idea. ;)

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Rank: 8Rank: 8

Post time 2015-3-18 04:47:14 |Show all posts
Feanyar replied at 2015-3-18 03:17
True, but achieving this equality could've been done by simply moving one UR from S4 into S8 to even ...

True dat.

I'm almost done hunting for cards in shops.
More intent on buying R4 Equipment now (hope they put more of them in the shops soon).

Note: there are 28 UR's and Rimmon in IM shop in 2 slots, 1 in 29 in 2 slots, about 1 in 14.5 average.
UR's in Arena shop, 1 in 12. I suspect they will try to maintain the chance to be about the same in both shops.

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